RE: RE: “Isaiah 9:6 mention Mesiah as Mighty God meaning Yahusha is The Almighty or?” – (03)
Quote from Samuel:
Yahusha : Everlasting Father or the Almighty Heavenly Father?
Is.9:6 reads, “For unto us a child is born, untous a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: andhis name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.”
Missing part: (this is the continuation from above of the original writer sent to me by the apologist)
“Is this prophecy declaringYeshua the Messiah to be the Heavenly Father? There are at least 27names in the Bible with the same Hebrew construction as in this verse. Each one means the “father of (something).” For example, Abishua means “father of plenty.”
My previous comment:
I don’t think the writer has anything to object here. Can ‘father of plenty’ be written ‘plentiful father’ without loosing its basic meaning? Since ‘the Heavenly Father’ or ‘the Father of Heaven’ or ‘the Father in Heaven’ is the same Person, then there shouldn’t be any problem with ‘the Father of Eternity’ or ‘the Eternal Father’ or ‘the Everlasting Father.’
This rebuke is for those who use this verse to claim Yahusha is the Father in Heaven! claiming Yahusha as Father of eternity is OK, because He is now the trunk of those who will live in the kingdom come.
This part is talking about the construction of Hebrews name for “father of…” to prove that the term “the Everlasting Father” is not related to Jesus. Do NOT change the course!
Missing part: (from the writer’s article sent to me by the apologist)
Instead of translating the phrase in Is.9:6 as “Father of eternity,” the KJV reversed the sequence making the true meaning harder to discern. Several newer versions correct this mistake such as The Emphasized Bible, The Bible in BasicEnglish, The New American Bible, The Holy Bible; A Translation Fromthe Latin Vulgate in the Light of the Hebrew and Greek Originals, andThe New English Bible, just to name a few. Yeshua is the Father of Eternity because eternal life comes to us through him. And so it is written in Heb.5:9, “And being made perfect, he became the author (or father) of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;”
Quote from Samuel:
Missing part: (of my previous comment)
We’ve better look at some versions of this Isaiah 9:6, before we talk about it and let us start with the older ones.
“Forsothe a litil child is borun to vs, and a sone is youun to vs, and prinsehod is maad on his schuldre; and his name schal be clepid Wondurful, A counselour, God, Strong, A fadir of the world to comynge, A prince of pees.” (Isaiah 9:6, John Wycliffe’s Translation)
“For a Child hath been born to us, A Son hath been given to us, And the princely power is on his shoulder, And He doth call his name Wonderful, Counsellor, Mighty God, Father of Eternity, Prince of Peace.” (Isaiah 9:6, Young Literal Translation)
“For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.” (Isaiah 9:6, KJV)
“For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.” (Isaiah 9:6, NIV)
It is obvious that Wycliffe and KJV separate the ‘Wonderful’ from the ‘Counselor’ while Young and NIV put them together as ‘Wonderful Counselor’.
On the other hand, Wycliffe used ‘A Father of the world to come’, Young put ‘Father of Eternity’, while KJV and NIV used ‘Everlasting Father.’ We don’t have a problem with these, do we? Why does the writer? KJV and even NIV do not do anything wrong with the ‘Everlasting Father’ and therefore correction will be unnecessary.
Missing part: (of my previous comment)
The writer should learn to be honest to admit that the term “Father” in the Bible has NEVER been associated with no one else but God – God the Father. The writer can always refer also to the term ‘God’ or ‘Mighty God’ and stop making up problems as if they really exist.
These two older Bible has put Hebrews 5:9 properly, as,
“and was made parfaite and the cause of eternall saluacion vnto all them that obey him:” (Hebrews 5:9, Tyndale’s Translation)
“and having been made perfect, he did become to all those obeying him a cause of salvation age-during,” (Hebrews 5:9, Young Literal Translation)
“and having been made perfect, he became unto all them that obey him the author of eternal salvation;” (Hebrews 5:9, American Standard Version)
The term “author” in newer version Bible came from the term “cause” used in older ones, which was translated from Greek word “aitios.” This “cause” or “author” cannot be translated as “father” which is “patera” in Greek (patEr = your father; patros = my father). Therefore, we should reject the writer’s statement completely.
The central prophecy in Isaiah 9:6 stays that the promised Child is Jesus the Messiah, Who is also God in flesh. Amen. Hallelujah!
As I say to say Yahusha is the father of eternity is OK, if you are relating this to the idea that He is the Heavenly Father, then you misunderstood the verse, the idea that Yahusha is the father of eternity must be grasp from the fact that He is the second Adam the father of the first human tree that will end because of sin, the second Adam that is Yahusha is also a father of second human tree that will continue for eternity,
in that way, this is the correct way of viewing Him as father of eternity not Eternal Father, otherwise once again you would need to explain
WHY JESUS PRAY TO HIS FATHER, SAYING OUR FATHER IN HEAVEN, HALLOWED BE YOUR NAME, WHERE IN FACT AS SOME PROPOSE HE IS THE FATHER IN THE FLESH?
The last part of this discussion has shown some dishonesty of the apologist who tried to manipulate the main point of discussion and deliberately removed some parts that clearly reveal the weakness of the writer’s argument who unfairly translated the Greek word “aitios” which mean ‘cause’ into ‘father’ which is “patera” in Greek.
I am not gong to answer such a childish question for it will be like throwing salt to the sea, that has no idea about the Holy Spirit (it’s so easy to unfairly attack Jesus’ deity from His physical side, isn’t it?). May the Holy Spirit have mercy on these people to reveal the truth about Jesus, including the secret of this following verse,
“Of the increase of his government and peace
there will be no end.
He will reign on David’s throne
and over his kingdom,
establishing and upholding it
with justice and righteousness
from that time on and forever.
The zeal of the LORD Almighty
will accomplish this.” (Isaiah 9:6)
“For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.” (1 Corinthians 1:21, NASB)
And with these verses I conclude my comment on this topic!